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Kira Posted: Wed Nov 18 10:04:32 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Immortality.

I am sure most people don't think about this nearly as much as I do, but I'm curious. It's a favorite philosophical question of mine. What affects would immortality have on a human being?

How many times would their feelings toward the situation change before settling on acceptance, be it bitter or content?

If the person were ignorant or evil in their early life, would they remain so, or would eternal life eventually force them to become wise and/or moral?

Conversely, is conscience tied to mortality, and would a person no longer nagged by the brevity of life learn not to fear the consequences of his actions? Would he retain no sense of sympathy or responsibility for the feelings and lives of others?

Would an immortal avoid forming relationships, to spare themselves the pain of loss? If not, how would they relate to their mortal friends and loved ones?

Would immortality simply destroy the mind, leaving only a lunatic inside an ageless body?

These questions assume that the person is invulnerable to trauma as well as age and disease, hence suicide is impossible.


 
ehwazingwaz Posted: Wed Nov 18 12:14:58 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Kira said:
>Immortality.
>
it would be fun for awhile, but i imagine a person could get bored. but then again, wolverine didn't really seem to get bored. just vengeful.

>I am sure most people don't think about this nearly as much as I do, but I'm curious. It's a favorite philosophical question of mine. What affects would immortality have on a human being?
>
i think about death alot. does that count?

>How many times would their feelings toward the situation change before settling on acceptance, be it bitter or content?

i think it depends on what they're having to accept. also, i've come to accept many things in life so far, and i can't change them because they already happened. i could change how someone (or how i) feels about any certain topic, but that's not a special power really. everyone could change anyone's mind.

>
>If the person were ignorant or evil in their early life, would they remain so, or would eternal life eventually force them to become wise and/or moral?

i think that eternal life has got a lot of different rules (unspoken & undefined because how does someone really define "forever?") if a person was ignorant/evil they would probably remain so until given some reason to become more deeply rooted in that or to do something good for someone. everything is a possibility.

>
>Conversely, is conscience tied to mortality, and would a person no longer nagged by the brevity of life learn not to fear the consequences of his actions? Would he retain no sense of sympathy or responsibility for the feelings and lives of others?
>
learning not to fear is a big step but is still achievable in this lifetime. and i don't think that a loss of mortality means a loss of a functioning mind. certainly the greeks would argue with you here in saying that the gods were all in possession of a conscious mind, and not all of them were good or moral (at least not completely) though they might not necessarily claim their obvious failures that would be more related to mortals. and plenty of people in history and today have no morals or sympathy for anyone else and can walk around killing people and they don't feel a bit of it landing upon their soul.

>Would an immortal avoid forming relationships, to spare themselves the pain of loss? If not, how would they relate to their mortal friends and loved ones?

possibly. i think it depends on the person. and if i were immortal, i'd certainly want to at least talk to people, even if only in passing. the pain of loss, much like conscious thought, is still prevalent and applicable to those who cannot die. how they would relate would be entirely based upon that specific person. dracula didn't relate very well (francis ford coppola's version of bram stoker's dracula).

>
>Would immortality simply destroy the mind, leaving only a lunatic inside an ageless body?
>
i believe it would destroy both, but if you drank from the fountain of youth, then technically you might remain at the age you were physically when you drank from the fountain. this is another point where the "rules" are foggy and defined by the specific audience you are addressing.

>These questions assume that the person is invulnerable to trauma as well as age and disease, hence suicide is impossible.

trauma, age, and disease could affect anyone i think, which would suck if one contracted leprosy...would they have it for life because medicine doesn't work on a body that doesn't age? and generally, with those folks who are immortal, there is some way to kill them... even if it is an obscure way and takes generations of witch doctors/shamans/etc to determine the proper method. at least your person/beast would still be around to experiment on..

these are some pretty intense questions you've got here.


 
Kira Posted: Wed Nov 18 14:26:05 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ehwazingwaz said:
>Kira said:
>>Would immortality simply destroy the mind, leaving only a lunatic inside an ageless body?
>>
>i believe it would destroy both,

If the body were destroyed as well, they ain't immortal, are they?

>>These questions assume that the person is invulnerable to trauma as well as age and disease, hence suicide is impossible.
>
>trauma, age, and disease could affect anyone i think, which would suck if one contracted leprosy...would they have it for life because medicine doesn't work on a body that doesn't age? and generally, with those folks who are immortal, there is some way to kill them...

Hold on, no ignoring the premise! The theoretical immortal in question possesses never-ending youth and never-ending (physical) health, period, full stop. The point is not to speculate on physical suffering or the possibility of death but to consider the psychological affects and potential behavioral changes over time.

>these are some pretty intense questions you've got here.

Fun, isn't it?


 
ehwazingwaz Posted: Wed Nov 18 14:48:32 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Kira said:
>ehwazingwaz said:
>>Kira said:
>>>Would immortality simply destroy the mind, leaving only a lunatic inside an ageless body?
>>>
>>i believe it would destroy both,
>
>If the body were destroyed as well, they ain't immortal, are they?

destroy here meaning the body would degrade but still live on, so one would age physically, but not die. (this links to your next statement)

>
>>>These questions assume that the person is invulnerable to trauma as well as age and disease, hence suicide is impossible.
>>
>>trauma, age, and disease could affect anyone i think, which would suck if one contracted leprosy...would they have it for life because medicine doesn't work on a body that doesn't age? and generally, with those folks who are immortal, there is some way to kill them...
>
>Hold on, no ignoring the premise! The theoretical immortal in question possesses never-ending youth and never-ending (physical) health, period, full stop. The point is not to speculate on physical suffering or the possibility of death but to consider the psychological affects and potential behavioral changes over time.

okay, so they can't have leprosy. what about if they are in a house fire? sure they won't die, but wouldn't their body be scarred the same way as any mortal person? immortality is not invincibility. the psychological effects could be very intense indeed, and i'm sure that anyone who was immortal would eventually develop some kind of PTSD, if not be on the brink of having an entirely new medical term created in order to describe what it is that they're going through. behavioral changes are expected, but what they will be is again, dependent upon the specific person and their habits/experiences/etc. definite psychological/behavioral changes would take place, regardless of any outside context an immortal person would go through.

>
>>these are some pretty intense questions you've got here.
>
>Fun, isn't it?

crazy fun!


 
ehwazingwaz Posted: Wed Nov 18 14:57:04 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ehwazingwaz said:

>so one would age physically, but not die.

and if they don't age externally, i think at least that their organs would. and simply being immortal keeps a dead organ in function so that person might survive? it seems there are a lot of flaws with immortality.


 
Kira Posted: Wed Nov 18 16:43:29 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ehwazingwaz said:
>
>and if they don't age externally, i think at least that their organs would. and simply being immortal keeps a dead organ in function so that person might survive? it seems there are a lot of flaws with immortality.

So interesting, how your mind rebels against the idea of immortality! Engage your willing suspension of disbelief, Waz. No physical decay!

I know that immortality and invincibility are separate, that's why I added the final qualifier at the end of my original post.

"Invulnerable to trauma" must logically mean one of two things - either the individual has an epidermis and skeleton which cannot be maimed or broken, or he is capable of hyper regeneration. Take your pick.


 
Puck Posted: Wed Nov 18 16:51:27 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Where to start here...

THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE!!

Anyway, as long as there are people to interact with, even if it's only in passing, I think it would be mentally reasonable to live indefinitely. This being the perfect-health version of it all. If the body degraded but say...the head always survived, it would suck to be a head in a jar, but roboticize that head and it'll all be cool.

If you're immortal and living long after all humans are dead, then it might get a little tricky to not get a little wacky.


 
ehwazingwaz Posted: Thu Nov 19 01:53:17 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Kira said:
>
>"Invulnerable to trauma" must logically mean one of two things - either the individual has an epidermis and skeleton which cannot be maimed or broken, or he is capable of hyper regeneration. Take your pick.

so, skeleton of steel, or very quick pops back into existence? hm. that's a tough choice.


 
ehwazingwaz Posted: Thu Nov 19 01:53:51 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Puck said:
>Where to start here...
>
>THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE!!
>


AH!


 
misszero Posted: Fri Nov 20 03:08:53 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  but if they put my head on a robot body, would i have the strength of ten gorillas? or metal teeth?


 
ifihadahif Posted: Fri Nov 20 07:36:23 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  misszero said:
>but if they put my head on a robot body, would i have the strength of ten gorillas? or metal teeth?
>
Or awesome hooters ?


 
ehwazingwaz Posted: Fri Nov 20 11:09:03 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  ifihadahif said:
>misszero said:
>>but if they put my head on a robot body, would i have the strength of ten gorillas? or metal teeth?
>>
>Or awesome hooters ?

that double as tommy guns?


 
Kira Posted: Fri Nov 20 18:48:58 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  If they put your head in a robot body, they're giving ME the remote, and I will FORCE you to compose a serious reply to this most interesting and enchanting thread topic!

And then I'll pass the remote to Nikki!


 
Puck Posted: Fri Nov 20 23:13:48 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  misszero said:
>but if they put my head on a robot body, would i have the strength of ten gorillas? or metal teeth?

standard-issue laser cannon


 
misszero Posted: Sat Nov 21 05:52:32 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  no sealab fans then? drats.
as for my serious reply.
i couldn't hack living forever. my favourite person mentioned how they wanna move away to get their doctorate. i responded by moving away first. weird abandonment issues that would mean the constant death of everyone would drive me entirely insane.


 
Puck Posted: Sat Nov 21 11:00:02 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  misszero said:
>no sealab fans then? drats.

Sorry, I was dieing to remember where that came from but it just wasn't coming to mind and I didn't want to look it up. I recognized it though, so it wasn't totally wasted. :)



 
Puck Posted: Sat Nov 21 18:28:34 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Speaking of immortality, Lobo rocks.
"who wants ta play a few rounds of 'hide the marble column'?"


 
Kira Posted: Sat Nov 21 18:43:06 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  I got the reference. I was just being cranky.

I think every one of has started a thread and wished it could just stay on topic, just for a little while, a dozen posts at least. But then, the rambling informality of the conversations here are a big part of what gives the forum its charm. I wouldn't change it, even if it does drive me crazy every now and then.

Sealab went down the tubes really fast after Captain Murphy, er... left? Died? Got another show? I hate when that happens.


 
Puck Posted: Sat Nov 21 20:26:06 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  Kira said:
>I think every one of has started a thread and wished it could just stay on topic, just for a little while, a dozen posts at least. But then, the rambling informality of the conversations here are a big part of what gives the forum its charm.

The threads would surely die if conversation didn't flow freely. If any of us had something to add that might be interesting and relevant to the original topic, it would probably get posted. It's better to let us ramble than have dead threads and/or nobody posting
I'd be happy to even get ramblings on my threads.


The convo must flow...


 
ehwazingwaz Posted: Sun Nov 22 02:09:35 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  thread ramblings do seem inevitable but we learn more about each other this way... and that sounds kinda lame I realized. I'd rather have a useful skill like invisibility over immortality, even though death is terrifying in my opinion. ah well...


 
Puck Posted: Sun Nov 22 16:17:10 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  The power of flight poses the question of weight limits. Invisibility is sucky when either you cannot see because the light passes freely through your eyes, or you can't shut them because your eyelids are transparent.


 
kurohyou Posted: Sun Nov 22 16:22:14 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  I remember an episode of Star Trek: The Next Generation where someone accompanied Q to the Continuum where they met with other Q's.

The Q's just standing there, doing nothing. Q said they had done everything there was to do and there was nothing left.

Interesting really.

I've always been intrigued by the story of The Highlander as well. It was fun to think about it and what would a person would do if they could live forever.

I'm guessing there would be a lot of hellos and a lot of goodbyes. I think after a while, depending on your personality you'd either be accepting of the life you have, or you'd become jaded.

For what it's worth...


 
ifihadahif Posted: Sun Nov 22 20:44:24 2009 Post | Quote in Reply  
  If I thought I was going to live forever, then my procrastinating would not be in vain . . .


 



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